zanshin	Are the rules because Linus wants them that way or are they based on something else?
jmgv	and class if you use c++ i suppose
snide	13min too late ;-(
jmgv	although c++ is not used at kernel :-)
gcc	the proper way to break a too long line
riel_	jmgv: the kernel is object oriented in places, for example the VFS
riel_	jmgv: but as Alan said it very nicely, object orientation is in the mind, not in the compiler
jmgv	how mandatory are these rules. I mean,... if i send a patch to be include at kernel, and i use 4 space
tab instead 8 space ones, is it mean the patch could be back to me for that reason?
jmgv	riel_ okey i see
riel_	jmgv: imagine a driver with 4 different programming styles in one .c file ;)
mulix	how about patches to clean up the coding style of old drivers?
mulix	are those a waste of time, or appreciated?
mulix	drivers/net/eepro100.c comes to mind...
jmgv	riel_ i see :-) it will be a curious kaos
snide	what about the unicity of the different function names all over the code ? is it a good thing, a bad
thing, a have-to ?
bh	uniqueness maybe?
snide	yes
snide	sorry about my english...
gregkh	no problem.
sarnold	so, how about typedef? :)
davej	(unless you're ingo)
gcc	why it so evil
viXard	umm, sorry
viXard	you meant evil?
boren	hey what about typedef for function pointer definitions?
gcc	got it
zanshin	what is bad about passing structures as parameters?
zanshin	the stacksize?
sarnold	zanshin: the kernel stack is only 8k...
snide	got disconnected sorry [ could someone be kind and msg me the reply -if there where any- ]
bh	you can pass a pointer to the structure, which saves memory, I think
zanshin	k thanks
sarnold	snide: 10:25 <@gregkh:#linux> yes, pick your function names well, and don't make them global unless
they have to be.
snide	sarnold: thx
gregkh	any other questions while the translation catches up?
riel_	sorry about the little split
tiri	It doesn't matter
viXard	gregkh you can continue :-)
snide	btw, how to make a function "global" ? put in in a .h ? or EXPORT ?
cdub	snide: global within kernel...non static definition in a c file, and an extern in a .h is good enough.
snide	but what about #ifdef CONFIG_SMP inside mm/slab.c for exemple
cdub	EXPORT_SYMBOL is needed if you want modules to be able to use it
snide	oops, i'm getting quoted too much...
snide	;-)
zanshin	is that the same as: struct foo = {
zanshin	read: func(),
zanshin	}
sarnold	zanshin, that is the GNU version... it is deprecated in favour of the new style..
cdub	zanshin: yes
snide	how to avoid using #ifdef CONFIG_MYOPTION in a practical way then [ any exemple ? ]
zanshin	ah okay
zanshin	any reason for that... just curious.
sarnold	the newer format was standardized in C99.. why they didn't just take the GNU format, I have no idea. :)
cdub	zanshin: gcc deprepated the use.  you get warnings with newer compilers
zanshin	I see
snide	so better split up the .c files ?
snide	so using a function that the content will be wiped out with an #ifdef ?
snide	gregkh: u should continue the talk, i don't want to hog u ;-)
gregkh	snide: that's it, I'm done unless there are more questions :)
snide	gregkh: ok ;-) so, i'll go through the URL and files that u pointed at
jmgv	one question
gregkh	sure.
jmgv	if i think i can contribute with some other rules i think can improve the code style or....
snide	gregkh: thx a lot
jmgv	i think one of them can be changed, where i can send my arguments?
gregkh	jmgv: to the linux kernel mailing list, but be prepared to back them up :)
jmgv	:-) okey
sarnold	jmgv: you aren't going to convince them to switch to C++ :)
cdub	heh
snide	sarnold: maybe C# then  ;-))
jmgv	i am starting to be convinced to switch to C :-)
raciel	hehe, C# would be an option! :)
snide	sarnold: (in link with the Mono talk we had)
gcc	gregkh: just one more
gcc	> Some notes:
gcc	> - coding style: linux functions usually have only one return at the end
gcc	> of the function, and goto internally.
gcc	see this on the LKML
snide	jmgv: C is rather unfrienldy, but it does much less magic behind ur back than C++ ;-) and that's good
for an OS [ IHMO ]
gcc	saw
jmgv	snide: sure!
gregkh	gcc: ah, good point, I'll add that one to my list.  It's a good thing to do.
snide	gcc: it's easier to track the exit point that way ;-)
gcc	snide: yeah, i allways use this, but always have some one saying that goto is lame
snide	although my C professor would jump if he sees a "goto" ;-)
raciel	gregkh: can you explain me what is data alignment and show me some example of that?
snide	gcc: goto is good if it help to follow a up-down algorithm path
gregkh	raciel: data alignment, like padding or packing data structures?
snide	gcc: quoted from Rusty's inline kernel docbooks
snide	;-)
raciel	gregkh: packing data structures
snide	fernand0: will there be a bibliography web page on the web site ?
fernand0	mmmm
fernand0	there will be whichever the authors provide
fernand0	of course, any links and references provided during the talk will be in the logs
snide	fernand0: sure, but i thought about a web page with all the links collected ;-)
gregkh	raciel: hold on, I have a good reference for that...
raciel	ok
fernand0	colledcted or extracted ?
snide	fernand0: a page that one can bookmark ;-p
gregkh	raciel: see http://www.linuxjournal.com/article.php?sid=5783 for all about that.
snide	fernand0: extracted [ my english is poor ;-( ]
fernand0	mine is also poor
snide	fernand0: seems better than mine ;-p
fernand0	but i do not understand well
fernand0	you are meaning a page with the links of this talk ?
snide	fernand0: u got the point ;-)
fernand0	i don't think so
fernand0	but it sounds as a good idea
twin	hola a todos
fernand0	maybe we should think about it
FJx	gregkh, this is a little off-topic question but... can you recommend me any good begginer's book for
Programming in Linux? or just plain ANSI C?
fernand0	it shouldn't be difficult to extract them
snide	fernand0: i know there isn't one here yet ;-) but i wondered if it is something that will appear ;-p
fernand0	we'l try
snide	fernand0: i'll even do it if u want [ by hand, since it's not a HUGE task ;-p ]
gcc	well, got to work...
fernand0	but just in case ... dowload the logs and grep http the_log.html
fernand0	hehe
gcc	gregkh: thanks for the lecture... very nice..
gregkh	gcc: no problem, was fun.  you all were an easy audience :)
snide	gcc: yeah, the talks are of a really good quality ;-p
sarnold	http://www.kroah.com/linux/talks/ols_2002_kernel_codingstyle_paper/codingstyle.ps
sarnold	http://www.kroah.com/linux/talks/ols_2002_kernel_codingstyle_talk/html/
sarnold	those are the two urls gregkh mentioned :)
snide	gregkh: execpt me ;-p [ ways too much questions ]
raciel	gregkh: other question, what technics do you use to debug your code? kdb? printk..?
sarnold	snide: i didn't think so... one nice feature of IRC conferences is that one can reach high levels of
interactions
gregkh	there's also other assorted ramblings that I've written lined off of http://www.kroah.com/linux/
snide	sarnold: ow... another valuable URL ;-p
gregkh	raciel: printk mostly.  haven't had to use a debugger yet, I do drivers, so debuggers don't help out
all that much at times with hardware.
snide	sarnold: yeah. it's the first IRC conf i'm doing, and it is wonderful ;-p
fernand0	leaving

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